SHRI E.M. SUDARSANA NATCHIAPPAN (SIVAGANGA): That was the position earlier. and that is why, the money was sent directly to the panchayats. If you see the history, you will come to know that adventurous work was done during the five year rule of Shri Rajiv Gandhi. He has done very great things for the 21st Century. But you have forgotten it and you want to crucify him. That is the wrong thing you are doing. You do not even want to mention the name of Shri Rajiv Gandhi for the very good work that he has done. But he has laid the foundation for the 21st Century on which you are now standing. You do not have anything great to say except the period of Shri Rajiv Gandhi's rule from 1984 to 1989. That is the foundation on which India stands now.

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: I am sorry, I have to interrupt you and ask you to conclude now.

SHRI E.M. SUDARSANA NATCHIAPPAN : Yes; I will conclude now. But, with your permission, I would make only one submission.

I would request the hon. Finance Minister that when the Budget is presented in this House, the third tier system of Panchayati Raj should be honoured by giving money directly to the panchayats.

Finally, in constituencies like Sivaganga, from where I am elected, some kind of insurance scheme should be there for the fishermen who suffer very much during such natural calamities. We have to treat it just like a drought prone area. I would request that constituencies like Sivaganga in every State should be taken as model constituencies where we should take it as a challenge and develop those constituencies in a proper way in a period of five years.

THE MINISTER OF PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS AND MINISTER OF WATER RESOURCES (SHRI PRAMOD MAHAJAN): Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, tomorrow is the last day of this Session. So, we have to have the reply to the Motion of Thanks on the President's Address and thank the President. So, as it was decided in the Business Advisory Committee, I propose that the sitting of the House should be extended by two hours and we should sit upto 8 o'clock to accommodate as many speakers as possible.

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Yes; it was decided in the Business Advisory Committee and the Leaders of all the Parties have also agreed to it. Otherwise, we will not be in a position to conclude that debate and the Motion of Thanks on the President's Address will be pending.

SHRI PRIYA RANJAN DASMUNSHI : Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, I agree that we should sit upto 8 o'clock, but not beyond. But I have a feeling that many Members would like to speak from the NDA, Samajwadi Party, Left Parties and, of course, the Congress Party, because a lot of wider issues have been dealt with in the President's Address. Nobody can predict what will happen about tomorrow's business, because many issues may come up. We will certainly sit upto 8 o'clock tonight. But if the trend of the House tomorrow is such that if many more Members want to speak on the Motion of Thanks on the President's Address, what is wrong in keeping the reply of the Government pending till the next Session? This can be done to accommodate more Members tomorrow.

Sir, we are told that the hon. Prime Minister is ill. We all desire that he should recover quickly and we wish him good health and long life. So, it will be in the fitness of things, even if the Members consume the whole day tomorrow, that the Prime Minister replies to the debate in good health in the next Session. This can be done, if required. This is my only prayer. Suppose we find enough time tomorrow itself to complete the debate, there is no problem. But I feel that many Members would like to participate in the debate tomorrow.

SHRI PRAMOD MAHAJAN: Sir, to the best of my knowledge, subject to your ruling, this is a Motion of Thanks on the President's Address, to thank the President for giving an Address to both the Houses of Parliament. If we do not thank him by tomorrow evening, this Motion will lapse.

SHRI PRIYA RANJAN DASMUNSHI : No; it is not correct according to Rules. The Motion never lapses so long as it is in debate. The proceedings are alive till the reply is given.

SHRI MANI SHANKYAR AIYAR (MAYILADUTURAI): Mr. Deputy-Speaker, Sir, I would like to remind the Minister of Parliamentary Affairs that in the year 1994, they blocked the proceedings on the discussion on the Motion of Thanks for several weeks before we could even begin it, let alone conclude it.

Therefore, there is no reason in terms of precedents.

SHRI PRAMOD MAHAJAN: Let us sit tomorrow. Why should we discuss it now and take time?

SHRI MANI SHANKAR AIYAR : We can sit tomorrow.

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: I think, it is premature to discuss that now.

Now, let us extend the time of the House. Is it the pleasure of the House to extend the time up to eight o'clock?


MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Now, the time has been extended. The hon. Minister will give a reply. Then, we will take up the Motion of Thanks.

ʶɴɮV ʺƽ (ʴn): ={vI ɽn, v |n ɪE g +< l* ʴn + Mɤn g E Eɮh n ɮ Sxɴ +M gx {c* ɽ xɨn xn +< g E Eɮh Vɮ Ex bڤ MB <ʱB +ɺɮ n VB*

ɨnɺ v +`ɴɱ ({f{֮): E n VB*

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Shri Athawale, neither there is a flood nor a cyclone in Maharashtra. You may kindly resume your seat.

... (Interruptions)

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: All right, now Shri Amar Roy Pradhan will speak for about three minutes. ... (Interruptions)

SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : For ten minutes.

MR. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Not for ten minutes.

SHRI AMAR ROY PRADHAN (COOCH BEHAR): Sir, in a natural calamity, a large part of the country has been affected, particularly in West Bengal, Bihar, Orissa and Andhra Pradesh. About 200 people have been killed. The list showing the total damage is not with me. But according to a report of the West Bengal Government, the loss in West Bengal is to the extent of Rs. 2,086 crore. 5,59,000 houses were affected. The roads were out of gear. About Rs. 321 crore will be required for repair of the roads. The Government of West Bengal has asked for Rs. 721 crore of Central aid.

I would like to ask a question through you particularly from the Minister of Home Affairs. He is here. Would he please tell us when did the Government of West Bengal ask for Rs. 721 crore? He did not pay a single farthing to them. What are the reasons? Can he tell us that he intends to have some political mileage from this opportunity in the name of relief? Is it a fact that he is having step-motherly feelings towards the States of West Bengal, Bihar and Orissa? I would like to know about it very clearly.

In this connection, I would like to approach the concerned Minister that agricultural loans and cooperative loans should be waived in the affected areas particularly in West Bengal, Bihar, Orissa and Andhra Pradesh.

Regarding natural calamity, we have got so many plans. Where is Shri Priya Ranjan Dasmunshi? He said about the States. We had got so many plans in the past also but those were prepared only in a casual manner. Is there any friend from Assam? They know it very well. The whole of Assam was not the seventh sister. To save Assam, in the Second Five-Year Plan, there was a plan called Brahmaputra-Ganga Canal. A survey was conducted. At that time, it was estimated to cost Rs. 2,000 crore. But nothing had happened. In that plan, it was also mentioned that, if necessary, it would be from Brahmaputra to Ganga and then to Cauvery. The entire country would be linked up and the country would not suffer.

My friend from Bihar said that if you like to save northern Bihar, you must have negotiations with Nepal. And if you like to save North Bengal, you have to have negotiations with Bhutan. For that purpose, in the 60's, there was also the Mansingh Committee's Report.

I would like to know what happened to that Mansingh Committee Report. It has been put in the wastepaper basket. Whatever Government was there at that time -- naturally the Congress Government -- it did not take care of all those things. I must say that it is time now that we do something in this regard. We do not know what is going to happen. It should not be done casually. According to today's weather report another cyclone is coming again tomorrow. It may be so. In the next session, we shall have another debate on the same topic again. We shall have some plans and programmes to save the people of our country from the natural calamities. For that purpose it is too late. In the last 52 years, we did nothing. At least, let there be a beginning of it.

Sir, once again I shall appeal to the concerned hon. Minister not to take it as a political issue. The people who are living in West Bengal or in Bihar or in Orissa are suffering a lot due to floods and cyclones. I would request him to send relief immediately. With these words, I thank you Sir.

ʶɴɮV ʺƽ Sx : ɽn, {S ʨx] nB Vɪ* n-n ɮ ɮ ɽ < Eɮh Sxɴ ] E ɮ ɽ g + M<*

... (ɴvx)

b.Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ (ɱ): ɽn, ʡ +` V iE nx E ɨɪ gx E E iɱɤ ?

... (ɴvx)

={vI ɽn : nںɮ ɤVE] , = {ɮ SS ְ M*

b Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ : ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ ɽ iɱɤ EE +iɨ +<] {ɮ ɽ + +SxE ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ ɽ EM* xxҪ n S E +iɨ +<] {ɮ ɽ , ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ ɽ xɽ , i Sɱ MB*

={vI ɽn : ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ vxɴn E |ɺiɴ {ɮ < ɽ E Ji i ɽ ְ EM*

b Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ : ɽ i E * xxҪ n Vx MB E +iɨ +<] {ɮ ɽ , ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ ɽ xɽ , <ʱB Pɮ Sɱ MB* U: V +SxE ɱ , i n Si VɪM* E =xE Sx ʨɱ E +` V iE nx E ɨɪ gE ɽ M*

={vI ɽn :ɽ i ʤVx BVɴ<Vɮ E] iɪ E * ɨɪ gx E |ɺiɴ + J + ɨɪ E BE]b E*

b Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ : U: V E {ɽ nx E +Mi Vx SʽB l, iɤ i n |iI Ei i E ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ vxɴn |ɺiɴ {ɮ ɽ Ex , Ex Sɱ MB* +ix +<] |EiE +{n E + = {ɮ ɽ Sɱ * M Sɱ MB, ɨZ E ɹ]{i E +ʦɦɹh {ɮ +V ɽ xɽ M* U: V xxҪ n Sɱ MB, + Si VɪM*

={vI ɽn : xxҪ +vI ɽn ֤ɽ 11 V VxEɮ n* ɴ =xx Bx=x E*

b Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ : ɽ ʴɹɪ +{ {ɮ Uci *

ʶɴɮV ʺƽ Sx : ={vI ɽn, {S ʨx] n nVB* g {ɮ SS , n J {ɮ ʴSɮ J MB *

={vI ɽn : + ʨxɺ] ɽn M*

... (ɴvx)

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: I have called the hon. Minister to reply. Please cooperate with the Chair. A number of speakers have spoken from all sections and all parties. Senior Members like Shri Raghuvansh Prasad Singh also wanted to participate.

... (Interruptions)

MR. DEPUTY-SPEAKER: We are short of time. I have already called the hon. Minister. It is not necessary for every Member to participate on every subject.

Oɨh ʴEɺ j ( xn ɱ {]) : ={vI ɽn, xxҪ n B Ij E ɮ +{ɺ |lx E , =xE + Ij ʨɱ Vֱ Ij *

ɽ <ix ɪE g +< E BE-n ɮ Sxɴ ]ɱx {c* E{ EE <xE +{ Sɮ-{S ʨx] x E ɨɪ n n i <xE i + VBM*

={vI ɽn : Z E< nEEi xɽ , x +` V iE = E ]< BE]b E * <x E V Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ V il +x xxҪ n x Sɽi * nںɮ +<] E {ڮ Ex , <ʱB x j V E ֱɪ *

... (ɴvx)

|ɦxl ʺɽ (ɽɮVMV): +{ ɤ E n-n ʨx] x nVB*

... (ɴvx)

={vI ɽn : `E , ɤ E n-n ʨx] n ni *

ʶɴɮV ʺƽ Sx (ʴn): xxҪ ={vI ɽn, {U nx V v |n E xɨn xn + ɽɪE xn {ɮ ix v - "M, ɮx + iɴ*" ɽ ix v BE l {x Uc n Mɪ + ix v BE l {x Ucx E Eɮh Miɮ i nx iE Ec Mƴ bڤ + {ڮ Ij MɦM iɤɽ E ʺli {ɽS Mɪ * <ʱB +{ɺ xɴnx Ex Sɽi E ɽ V ɽi E Eɨ x l =ɨ v |n E ɮEɮ x +{ɮvE {ɮɽ E , E ɽi E Eɨ xɽ B + x E {xɴǺ E Eɨ |ɮ +* J E]ɮ E ɱ xɹ] M<* +iɴʹ] E Eɮh {ڮ Ij Vɽ ɤx S Mɪ, ɽ ʱɪ +Eʮi * Vɮ E ^ +E֮ xE +B* MɦM {ڮ Ij iɤɽ S M< *

ɽn, +{E vɨ xɴnx E < {ɮ Exp ɮEɮ iI{ E* ɽ BE ExpҪ n V, V {ڮ <E E ɴIh E + ɴ EE = <E E ɽi il +ɴV nx E {ڮ ɴɺl E* BE xɴnx ɽ E v {x Ucx E BE ʴSʮi xi xx SʽB iE B ʴ{iiɪ ɮ-ɮ x +B + V ix Vɱ Mɤn, ɪɺx + ʺɽ =xE ɮ xɪ ɱ Ҩ Vx E +iMi ʨʱi E VB iE E E =x <E E < Vx E ɦ ʨɱ E* ɽ {ڮ <E E cE IiOɺi M< , {ֱ-{ʱɪ ]] M< , <E ʱB BE ʴɶ {EV x E ɽ ɽi + {xɴǺ E Eɨ |ɮ EB VB* ɽi-ɽi vxɴn*

b Pִƶ |ɺn ʺƽ (ɱ): ={vI ɽn, n E Sɮ V V |EiE +{n < =ɺ Eɤɱ E ʱB + =ɺ V {ci M =x E ɽi {ɽS< VB il ɽʱɪi n VB, < {ɮ nx ɽ Sɱ * ]x E nɴ <xƺ Eʨɶx x +xֶƺ E, E V E +M-+M ʮҡ E ʱB b E <iVɨ E* Vɺɨ ʤɽɮ E =nɽh ni , =E 52 Ec {ɪ n Mɪ* <ɨ ix ʽ Exp ɮEɮ E nx l + BE ʽ V ɮEɮ E nx l* V ɮEɮ <ix <xʶɪɱ F< E +{x ʽ V ɮEɮ xɽ n {i + Exp ɮEɮ xʶSi Vi , V ix ʽ nɴ <xƺ Eʨɶx E ʽɤ b E BEx + ɽ nx Exp ɮEɮ ɨZi E ɮ EiǴ {ڮ Mɪ* Ex n E ʴʦxx ʽ V |EiE +{n ɨp iڡx, g + {c E{ +i =ɺ Eɤɱ E ʱB V ɮEɮ Iɨ xɽ * xxɪb x V |ɺiɴ E E V ɹ]Ҫ +{n ɽɪi E , Vɺɨ Ec {B xɨɨj E b BEx i , ɽ gx SʽB* VɺE Eʹ j V +vI + J j V ]x =ɨ n * =xx |ɺiɴ E E xxɱ Eʨ] ʮҡ b gx SʽB* =ɨ + V Ec E |ɴvx =ɨ E E BE Vɮ Ec {B gx SʽB, {ci Vxi E l ɽ VE xɽ x SʽB* |vxɨj V VE ɽ Bx E n E f< Ec {B E nn E + = V E ]ű +Һ]ƺ E Bbƺ n n, +x E< ʮҡ nn xɽ E {i, SE V] |ɴvx xɽ * <ʱB xxɱ Eʨ] ʮҡ b Ec {B g E BE Vɮ Ec {B Ex ɱ xɽ*

j V < i E Vɴɤ n E ɽ = {ɮ ʴSɮ Ex ɱ xɽ? E +i +ɶɺx nB Vi ? B PhB EE xɴi E l VE i * < i E P |iɴn Ei * ʽxnֺix BE c {ʮɮ * ɽ E M |EiE +{n VZi * ʤɽɮ ɱ g, Jc iɤɽ i * x{ɱ E +xiɮǹ]Ҫ xn iɤɽ + ɮn i * <ɺ Ec {B E ɱ ɮn i , Vx-ɱ E Ii i , cE ]] Vi , Vxɴɮ ɮ Vi * <ɺ ɮEɮ vx E ɮn i * < ɮn E Exp ɮEɮ E Vɨ x SʽB* B iɤɽ E ɨɪ V ɮEɮ E {ɪ{i ɽɪi nx SʽB* vxɴn*

Pxl Z (M{ɱMV) : xxҪ ={vI ɽn, n E ʦxx-ʦxx M Sɽ ɨp iڡx , g , +ɴʹ] Jc + +Eɱ V {ʮʺli {n < , = {ɮ ɽ *

18.21 hrs. (Shri K. Yerrannaidu in the chair)

ɽ i ɴʴni E iڡx =cҺ ɪE { |ɦʴi + * =E +ɮ +xw|n, {ʶSɨ Mɱ + ʤɽɮ {ɮ {c * M ʤɽɮ |n +i * =iiɮ ʤɽɮ |iE ɹ g E S{] +i * B E {ɮ +{x |ɪ xi MǪ VxxɪE E{ڮ `E֮ E n Ex Sɽi * ɽ ɮɤɮ +䨤ɱ Ei l E Vɤ iE ɮi ɮEɮ E x{ɱ i xɽ M, E< ɨZi xɽ M, iɤ iE ʤɽɮ E nJ nڮ xɽ M* ɮ ɽ x{ɱ E xn ɮn i * <ɺ ɮ Vɨx ɮn i * <xɣɺ]ESɮ V ɱ ɮ iɮ i , ɽ ɮn Vi * ɮi ɮEɮ E Vɺ iɮ nn Ex SʽB, ɽ xɽ Ei *